Doping poll

[Smokin_Joe]

I asked this question last year and got some interesting replies, but now I know how to use the poll thingy and the forum has a lot more users, plus the revelations of the past few weeks here we go again.

Remember, you would have been aware that most riders were on something and you would probably have been assured by the doctors who administered your poisen that it was undetectable and medically safe.

[PaulJames]

The answer's an even more definite no this time around

[campagchris]

The thing is we don't know what the riders were told.I.E. if your a young rider and the doc says you need a vitamin injection and your cream crackered you would take it.As you believe in the people who look after you.I know thats a million miles away from blood doping,but did the naive riders not know what they were taking.
I remember a great N.E. roadman giving me olbas oil before a race as I was having trouble breathing with a touch of bronchitis,and I didnt know what it was then,any how he said your ok your safe,and I believed him.He was of course right.Mind he knew I was no threat to him riding away from us :p or i might have got the cod liver oil and orange juice

[good_one_shaggy]

In Graeme Obree's autobiography he claims that when he joined a pro-team he was asked to pay a portion of his wage for "medical back-up", he refused, was ostracised and never raced the tour.

BBC Link (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/special_report/1998/07/98/tour_de_france/142008.stm)

[Brian]

If you wanted badly to be a pro and it depended on getting a contract, I probably would have done so. It's only years later , when your more mature and with the benefit of hindsight, and considering the health dangers, your opinion would change.
It's easy saying no when your not in a posation thats it,s a career issue.

[buzz]

In Graeme Obree's autobiography he claims that when he joined a pro-team he was asked to pay a portion of his wage for "medical back-up", he refused, was ostracised and never raced the tour.



Is this the guy who was quite open when he was doing the hour record attempts - taking blood from his sysyem a week before the ride, storing it, and putting it back in his body just before the event to increase the red cell count and therefore oxygen capacity. Is that doping? :o But his refusal to pay the 'medical' charge at Le Groupement casts a shadow over Robert Millar, doesn't it?

The fact is that anyone who was any good was at it on the big tours. Past history, but we should be focusing on now and the future.

[good_one_shaggy]

Is this the guy who was quite open when he was doing the hour record attempts - taking blood from his sysyem a week before the ride, storing it, and putting it back in his body just before the event to increase the red cell count and therefore oxygen capacity.



Seriously? Obree doped? That would make me dissapointed, he's my favourite cyclist.

[James70]

Buzz, think you need to be careful with that one. Obree NEVER admitted to blood doping. You've quite openly libelled him there. Obree was very honest in his book, but he never said he doped. Think you may have confused him with someone else.

[aphextwin]

Buzz - I'm pretty sure Obree never did anything like that. Where did you get that from?

[James70]

Quite right Brian, it's very easy to vote no, now that we're all a little older and wiser. My mouse hovered over the 'not sure' button for a while, but I did eventually vote no. I'm pretty sure that had the situation arisen when I was riding that my conscience would have made me do the right thing.

As for Campagchris's idea of doctors doping riders unwittingly; sorry but that's rubbish. It's an excuse the riders used, just like 'I got it from a dirty water bottle' (a la Hondo). It may have happened back in the 60's, but in the day and age of EPO and blood doping, the rider knows exactly what's happening.

These drugs/procedures are only useful when used alongside a structured training program. Also, a doctor injecting a rider unknowingly with EPO would be extremely dangerous. I imagine that 99.9% of the time, a rider knows what's going on.

[aphextwin]

Simoni's cocaine is granny's sweets is still my all-time favourite "how on earth did that get in my blood sample" homework excuse. Mind you, Floyd's testosterone/beer one was pretty hot too.

[good_one_shaggy]

Hamilton's chimera excuse was a cracker...

[Smokin_Joe]

I put in a yes vote.

Much as I would like to see doping eradicated, I think that in the days before the present climate when many riders are now openly coming out against the practice the situation was different.

From what I remember of Kimmage's book it was so widespread that you were not really accepted as "one of the boys" unless you doped too. For a young rider trying to earn a living from the sport and gain the respect of his peers that must have been an enormous pressure, particularly if you realised that your results were suffering because you were clean. Not everyone earns a fortune from the sport, to the majority it gives them a living and if they could not get a contract the bills would not be paid.

[buzz]

Nothing libelous whatsoever - I never accused the Obree of anything, I asked a question - 'is this the guy who'....There's a difference between making an accusation and opening up a debate by asking a question.

Also, I'm not sure if boosting your system by doing that was illegal at that time, can you guys tell me?

[thatwomanagain]

Also, I'm not sure if boosting your system by doing that was illegal at that time, can you guys tell me?



Back in the 1970s or thereabouts I believe that blood doping -reinjecting your own blood to aid recovery - was considered to be a sensible practice for Olympic athletes e.g the 'Flying Finns', because it didn't involve any alien substances.

[NickdSaint]

yup, tis true!! and the Italian long distance/marathon squad were all "at it" from early on too!!!
see any similarities with cyclesport!!!
those "high up" in their sports' governing bodies have always though that if they can "gain an edge" - especially if it's undetected - then they'll "advise" their athletes that it's in their best interests!!! not all athletes will be so nieve and do it, but there'll ALWAYS be a few from each generation who'll go for the "easy way to glory"!!
it's as much bad human nature really as anything!! :(